we need to cut down on our time because we have been going slow due to a variety of things. we do well up to Garr then we seem to slow down at lava packs. here are a couple of changes we will make:

- tank healers on trash will be rotated out. at most you should only need 1 priest and a druid or 2 priests/druids on a warrior. if they are having problems then we might add 1 more. they will heal the MT till they need to drink and 2 others will take their place. shamans can spot heal DPS and for most of the trash, people shouldn't be taking much damage. we will be constantly pulling and healers will have to work it out.

- everyone who has a remove curse/magic should be spamming it on mobs that curse or debuff with magic. have your decursive up and spam it when we need it. we shouldn't have only 1 or 2 people removing stuff. also prioritize it if you haven't already done so. stuff that reduces int/spi should be removed from healers/casters first and not tanks and stuff that reduces HP/FR needs to be taken off the tank first. etc. we should know this by now.

- pulling aggro is not a big issue but don't do it anyway. the less healing needed on the raid the better. stuff like destroyers and dogs can do AOE damage and bringing them into the raid is bad.

- on Baron we will try it with having the MT in there eating the hellfires. this will alow the ranged dps to keep going and should drop him faster.

- for shazzrah we will pull him to Garr's room. so after Baron we just need to kill 1 lava pack (to our right) and then do Shazz.

- we will avoid the 2 other lava packs in Shazz's room and hug the wall up to sulfuron. we might have to kill 1 dog in shazz's area but that's it

- warlock banishes should be sorted out by the warlocks. we will always set the same 2 warlocks on 1 elemental but sometimes a loose one can stun the whole raid so we will also put 1 warrior on an elemental to keep em pointed away just in case.

- do NOT ninja AFK for trash then come back to bosses. if you need to go afk then say in raid chat or better yet message the leader/officer and put someone one follow (or stay in a safe place) and put your AFK tag on. otherwise it looks like you're mooching off the rest of the raid.

any other suggestions are welcome.

you can pull the lava pack to the right before baron...the key is just timing your trip over to pull them over correctly with Barons laps (and dont stop to tank/banish them close to his patrol route). This way you get to do the two boss fights back to back .

Dreadmear, i couldn't agre with you more.

just a couple of other things to point out.

- if you die. DO NOT take a unannounced 15-30 min AFK. There are way too many times where people are rezzing people over and over again and they are not there. Too many times i've heard, multiple rezzers say that they've tried rezzing the same person several times. Then 20 minutes later someone say, hey i need a rez.

- if you die. DO NOT release unless you died in a really bad spot. It's easier to find bodies when they haven't released. This way people don't waste too much time trying to find you to rez or do summons after you have run back.

- DO NOT take an AFK before Baron!! We waste so much time setting up for baron because people are taking AFK. We can not start baron unless everyone is there. If you need to AFK, pop-up an AFK like /afk AFK in garr's room and tell your party/raid.

- Everyone needs to be on vent. That means you need at least listen to what's going on. There are way too many times i've heard Dreadmear, Hunding, or others go "so-and-so are you there" "are you there" over and over because so-and-so is not responding to vent, whispers, raid chat, guild chat, etc, and we're waiting for that person. I listen to music too or have the TV on, but I have it loud enough where I can hear what's going on in the raid.

- People need to go AFK. That's totally understandable. tell the raid leader, the people in your party, and pop-up your afk flag with a message /afk had to answer the phone. brb. Put yourself on auto-follow on someone, and get back to the raid as soon as you can.

- Show up to the raid prepared. Warlocks need shards, Priests need candles, Mages need powder, etc. Everyone needs to bring potions and banadages. Make sure your FR gear (and whatever else gear you need) is in your bags.

- Everyone needs CT-RaidAssist. Sadly, i've noticed that most of the people who refuse to install CT-RaidAssist in ZT are the worst culprits of being ninja AFKers since CT-RaidAssist shows when people have their AFK tag up.

The Ninja AFKs is an issue that might need to be addressed separately. Do some random ready checks. Note who doesn't respond. continual non-repsonsive people get removed from the raid to let someone else in. if they are noticably ninja AFK raid after raid, then perhaps they are not allowed in the raid at all.

(ZT has a really bad problem with the ninja AFKs people and the people who are AFK for trash but miracously are there for the boss fights.... so you can see that's not a happy topic for me. )

Pookievander wrote:

The Ninja AFKs is an issue that might need to be addressed separately. Do some random ready checks. Note who doesn't respond. continual non-repsonsive people get removed from the raid to let someone else in. if they are noticably ninja AFK raid after raid, then perhaps they are not allowed in the raid at all.


i like the random ready check idea but i hope we don't get to that point. people do need to get off their comp for maybe 20 seconds to get a drink or w/e but a simple "brb drink" or "brb washroom" and then a /afk tag is all we ask.

One thing that gets me is the AFK during loots. Once everyone is up and buffed, I think everyone should move up while boss loot is being distributed. There's no reason you can't say "yes I want that" when the leader asks you as you're fighting a surger. Once the loot is assigned to you, run back and get it.

At the very least, the 35 people who don't have a chance of getting loot can move up, and that's all we really need to clear trash. This alone will save us 30 minutes on a run.

Also as Dread already said we need to do better healing assignments, we crossheal like mad and as a result get a significant amount of overhealing. I'm seriously guilty of getting 50% of my heals off 0.25s after someone else fills up my target.

I rather enjoy getting healed for ~1k by three different people after I've taken 500 points of damage. It makes me feel special.

You are special, just a different kinda special.

wait, so i'm not allowed to autoshot afk?

Int wrote: Also as Dread already said we need to do better healing assignments, we crossheal like mad and as a result get a significant amount of overhealing. I'm seriously guilty of getting 50% of my heals off 0.25s after someone else fills up my target.

Tot often hits me with a crit Gheal for ~4000, and about 300 of it actually heals me. He's even done it to me twice in one fight

http://www.curse-gaming.com/en/wow/addo ... lsync.html

God that addon rocks. It lets you see what spells the other healers are casting on your target. It basically lets you time your Greater Heals perfectly. That should greatly help the problem.

Yes, overhealing is a problem. The way to deal with it is to give people more direction about who to heal. You need a few people focused on the MT/OT. Everyone else just focus on healing your party. Of course in certain circumstanes particular people such as warlocks need to be watched. Have one shaman in charge of rezing people unless there are multiple people down. In that case the other shaman can help out.

That doesn't mean you heal your party exclusively. If you see several people in 1 group getting hit, obviously their healer is going to need help.



Also here is a possible solution to the lava packs. Pics incoming:

Ok on the lava pack pulls, you have the hunters distracting shot the lava elementals after the warriros shoot the flamewalker and other dude.

The big circle is just the rest of the raid.




The warlocks banish the elementals as they go towards the hunters. When they come out of the banish they will still be agro'd to the hunters, assuming the hunters don't FD. Hunters can take a few hits, but need healing to keep them up. They make sure that when the elemental comes at them, it is facing away from the raid (i.e. by keeping the elemental between them and the raid as shown below).

There's a difference between "ninja AFKing" and planning your AFK's around boss fights. It's impossible for me to raid for five hours without leaving my computer once in a while (food is a good thing), so I try to leave just after boss fights. Because having an AFKer right before the Baron fight sucks tremendously.

Also, healing isn't totally random, but what little organization there is goes completely unspoken. Generally, a couple priests wind up as the main healers. The other priests and druids join the shamans in spot-healing, but they also keep an eye on everyone else in the raid.

I'm somewhere in the middle. I spam rejuv all over the place, mostly because if someone falls low I can swiftmend them. If swiftmend is down or someone doesn't have a druid HoT on them, I'll NS-heal them. If that's down, I'll cast regrowth (2 second cast, 50% crit).

I'm only talking about trash mobs here. When someone's low on health during a trash fight, I'll liberally overheal them. I'll be drinking soon enough, and wasted mana is better than wasted repair bills. There's always innervate if something goes wrong.

On bosses, when we actually organize our healing, it's much cleaner and more efficient. We can structure it when we need to, and that's what matters.

So don't worry about overhealing on trash mobs. We clear MC every week; the healing is fine. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Zagra wrote: So don't worry about overhealing on trash mobs. We clear MC every week; the healing is fine. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

but you can reduce mana useage, and therefore reduce downtime. It's pretty simple to just have a few people designated to heal MT/OT and have everyone else focus on healing their group.

also with warlocks you guys work out your curses on your own? or should we start assigning one warlock per curse for the entire raid? like vag on CoS, melvica on CoE and 1 other on CoR? we will put CoR on all mobs in MC from now on. i guess i've been overestimating them. the only mobs that pose a threat by having buffed AP are ones that MS.